wah cogan garang

Kingdom manga/anime is always in top charts but never talked about enough
that Zheng speech left me speechless just like the people in that room
with music and voice acting it was 10/10
I know that a lot of people find this boring and want xin stuff, but THIS IS THE REAL BATTLE!
it's always been...Zheng vs Lu Buwei and I'm glad it's been given enough screen time

there is a person like 3-4 comments up complaining about how zheng wouldn't shut up this episode. blows my mind how such a compelling statement could be made and thats all people take from it

tbh I don't know what people expect from this story after 700 chapters and 4 anime seasons....this is Zheng's story just as much it is Xin's story...hell it might not be even their story...like this meeting between Zheng and Lu Buwei...
this is peak war right there!
for like 3 seasons this is been the moment many wanted to see....like yeah the coalition invasion arc was cool had a lot of action and battles but I think this here is a turning point in the story (I haven't read the manga so I don't really know)
but it feels like a turning point, bcuz how much they hyped this confrontation
and I'm glad they gave Lu Buwei a sound argument...and not some shit reason or a backstory out of nowhere for going this far
he's a merchant through and through and he always solved his problems with money why wouldn't he think he can rule the kingdom with money at this point?

I'm happy you got all that as an anime-only. This is indeed a big turning point.

Indeed, very happy they're spending an abundance of time on their extremely important discussion. A lot of pauses to let things sink in. Very nice overall.

what's your take on the balls of light tho?
I know in ancient china, belief in gods and spirits and heavens weren't uncommon and we've already seen ''supernatural'' stuff, but a lot of people don't seem to like it in this episode...

The balls of light is too cliched in my opinion. Its like they want to make Ying Zheng speech as the absolute truth, while putting in polar opposite of Lu Buwei speech that is absolute wrong.

They're the spirts of his ancestors. It's a thing that part of Asia believed in.

Yea, but kingdom isnt a spiritual anime to begin with. Ying Zheng being surrounded by his ancestors spirits clearly implies that he's on the side of justice, while Lu Buwei is the opposite. I just find that depiction to be a little too forced cause there is no absolute right/wrong. Imo, those two should be more like Yin and Yang.

tbh there is a point I agree with you here...
Lu Buwei isn't really in the wrong in terms of ideals (not the fact that he almost got half the capital killed) but more like....he's a realist
while Ying Zheng is a dreamer....a realist vs a dreamer
we get this all the time, and neither are absolute...so making Lu Buwei wrong cuz they kinda need this antagonist in the story...you know the bad guy...

Yes, thats exactly what I think as well

It doesn't matter if it isn't a spiritual anime, it's an anime about ancient China, and this is just their culture

It does matter when the show stray from its core. It holds no purpose nor importance to their discussion other than to force an opinion on the viewers.

I don't care what you think about it making him the god guy or not. I'm just stating a fact that they're the spirits of his ancestors

Dude, then dont bother replying me if you dont care. I'm simply stating my opinion to the other guy, I dont even ask for your response nor your opinion. You're the one who butt in the comments and get all emo about it. You're weird man.

I'll phrase it differently then, I'm not talking about whether it makes him look as the good guy or not. I'm just stating a fact which is; they're the spirits or souls ancestors.

Bruh, I'm a fecking asian, I know that. So really, what about it? Why you think its so important for me to know?

Its not an exclusive asian thing to begin with. Its pretty universal around the world, similar light orbs representing spirits known by different names in different culture. Just google it, you'll find out.

No need to get emotional

Yea, dont take it personally bro. I'm not emotional to you in person, rather I'm emotional about what you're trying to do. Because to my understanding, you're trying to tell me about something but not expecting any response. So, really I dont get the point of telling a person about something just for the sake of telling it. You know normally, if we dont expect someone to react or do something with an information; then, we probably dont need to share such information to them.

I don't either in this particular case.
The balls of light, to me, simply look like the souls of the people who were special to him and in a way embody his philosophy, so they get to appear as balls of light instead of ghostly hands clawing their way up. It's definitily not uncommon for the time, but I feel it's still more a typical anime-thing than a cultural thing.

The reasons I'm not a big fan of putting 'supernatural' in this situation, is something I can't really explain well. But this didn't happen in the manga and I did feel his speech was more powerful in the manga as a result. He didn't need any 'supernatural' encouragement to state his thoughts, while he seemed rather hesitant & perturbed here.

I can only say that adding 'supernatural' stuff as spice doesn't always end up making it better automatically. This was Zheng's big moment, his battle. I think we naturally like it more when they don't need assistance from the sidelines to win.

so that was an anime thing only?....damn
yeah I get you....I think... that was the moment he should've showcased his growth as a king and as a person I mean he did do so....nothing wrong with getting a bit of help but the whole ''connecting people'' that was something he should have come to conclusion by himself rather than a push from his ancestors, it would have showed his growth even more
still that speech as an anime only all I can saw is that it was amazing to watch

Glad to see it still left its mark.

They're Zhang's ancestors, it's a thing that part of Asia believed in

that magazine surprised me lmaoo

While most of the conquerors in history wanted a World Domination...
I just realized that Kingdoms of Ancient China are the only one wanted to keep conquer Middle Kingdom again and again almost as if everyone has forgotten about the outside world XD

You know that in ancient china, they regards people outside of the middle kingdom as uncivilized barbarians. The world revolves around the middle kingdom as it is the peak of civilization and culture, thats part of the reason why.

Sounds like their people are still the same when I compare them with today's China xDD

Well yea.. u got that right.. and that was a major reason too why they needed a unified china… later when guns and the beginning of engines starts around the world.. the world power lies mainly in europe… europe as its known for starts invading and trading other continents for goods .. parts in china realize they need a national security therefor need to be strong as one to actually face the world and stop these kids fighting

Except China never did become strong, just a fake cheater

A cheater may be, but China is pretty strong tho. Through espionage, they steal technology that has the potential to rival the US. Through loans and connections, they're setting up a modern silk road, which will surely propelled them forward as a new global super power. If you really think about it, China can be compare to Lu Buwei's idea of unification through money and connections, while America and Europe can be compare to Zheng's idea of unification through military might.

Bro Usa has crashes ufo ships to reverse engineer, china never catching up no matter how much they steal!

When running on foot is fastest option you war on next villages (and then proceed further), when you have horses you war on neighboring countries, when you have ships capable of fast enough overseas travel and other similar transportations... world is the limit. You need to have option to feed the supplies and backbone. Not to mention if you stretch too quick your area coverage is either too thin or it breaks at first revolt

It is just a simple matter of what is achievable. Anyone waring and stretching over this simple principle simply lost.

Yes and no. Think of the Roman Empire and the Mongol Empire. They were frigging huge and that in an era without steamships, telegraphs... Let alone, our technology...It strikes me with awe realising how they managed to achieve the impossible, while today we have it so much easier and yet fail at trivial things...

Romans suffered when they overstretched. Same as Greeks and Nazis as well as any conqueror in EU.
Mongols as nomads don't really fall into the equation. They kept invading for plunder and after successful plunder they either moved or fallen back.

Nah you're actually wrong there, Rome experienced its greatest prosperity and social welfare at the time it was at its largest, it failed due to successive leaders not raising to the task and internal regimes starting rifts. They weren't issues of overreach, but issues in how leadership was selected. The same happened to the Mongols after kublais death and a 13 yo took over, this then began the collapse of the empire.

a combination of inflation, bad leaders and relentless barbaric invasions and a lot of other factors ruined Rome. And Mongols through ruthlessness became bigger than they could support

You can read the history for yourself but the mongols literally began splintering the second the 13yo took over, other powerful mongols (including some cousins) believed someone older with experience should rule and started splitting their factions off, the 13yo couldn't hold it together while he was loosing battles in china.

Alexander the Great has conquered more on foot, then most conquering countries did on horseback. Theoretically it doesn't get more logical than that, faster means of transportation is more area coverage in the same span of time.

But there's clearly more to 'overreaching' than the limitations of your means of transportation and its upkeep.

and yet near india he is known as alexander the fool, because he overstretched to the east in search of answers to immortality and his army got shredded

So what... Even you realize calling someone 'Alexander the Fool' only has bearing on that particular moment where his megalomania happened to overshadow his common sense. It doesn't really take anything away from my earlier point. Plenty conquerors overstretched on horseback & got shredded long before Alexander overstretched on foot. Logic broken. We'll need to search for a more accurate answer by taking into account other factors as well.

One has to wonder about a lot of things. Why didn't the Parthian Empire or Median empire, known for their horse-based culture, manage to conquer more land? Well, probably because not all land is as easily traversable as their deserts. Why didn't the Northmen make better use of their superior longboats to invade & conquer lands everywhere? I have no idea, but they diligently kept to small-scale raiding for the most part. They explored & navigated the sea, ended up making tiny settlements in nomansland. But start measuring all the land they took by boat and it probably still wouldn't amount to much at all.

That's because they didn't know anything about the outside world. Even Rome thought that way

They didn't have to hit us with Xi Zia flashbacks like that 😭

"Though I may be criticized as a tyrant, I shall use might -- to unite the entire Middle Kingdom with impartiality and equal standing!" Words of greatness and immeasurable self-sacrifice. And it seems to have re-kindled something in Lu Buwei!

Lelouch would be proud of him!

gat dam, Zeng's speech had me in tears irl, I want to be that passionate about something

Lu Buwei speechless AF! Bravo of an episode once more!

"I will stop war, with war!"
No lip service, no bs. just FACTS. It's a warring state, there's no escaping war.
But i love how he say he's gonna end the 500years of war in his generation so the next generation wont have to suffer. The man's vision is like 9000light years ahead of Lu buwei.
Damn .

A nice speech from Zheng, but a hollow one. In our reality at least Buwei was completely right. Historically, ~60 years after he achieved his dream the people rebelled and under the claim that they're restoring the former states fractured his empire. The grudges of the defeated nations aren't just going to vanish.

Its interesting that it not only happened in china but in japan as well. The one who did the conquering wont be the true winner, its the next guy who truly wins. Like Oda and Toyotomi did the hard work, but after their death, its Tokugawa that reap the benefits.

That's what "moving towards a better direction" means, even if you don't succeed what you entrust will be inherited and succeeded by newer generations. This is where "light" comes in. As long as you keep your direction right and keep walking towards it, you are destined to reach "greater heights" of that direction.